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Post by MsElliott on Feb 11, 2015 9:50:34 GMT
"We know who ought to say things here!" How is Jack undermining the authority of the conch?
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Post by lindadate on Feb 12, 2015 5:01:53 GMT
Jack is undermining the authority of the conch by not holding it while he is speaking and not letting others who are holding it have their turn to speak. Jack saying "we know who ought to say things" suggests that he thinks he should be the one who has the biggest say, and boys such as Simon, Bill and Walters opinions and ideas did not matter.
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Post by lilyklunyk on Feb 15, 2015 8:53:17 GMT
Jack doesn’t believe that they need the conch any longer because he thinks that there are certain people who should have a say and that everyone else shouldn't have a say. He has always resented the conch. Jack wishes to have control and the ability to state his opinions whenever he wants without anyone disagreeing, but the conch is his obstacle to power. By undermining the conch, he is showing the other boys that the conch doesn't have much authority, seeing as though he can speak without it.
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Post by remimckenzie on Feb 16, 2015 6:06:31 GMT
"We know who ought to say things here!" How is Jack undermining the authority of the conch? Jack is undermining the authority by not abiding by the rules that were first stated when they all became one group. Jack thinks that his opinion matters more than everyone elses, therefore doesn't need to have the conch to speak. This represents the falling of the community. |
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Post by remimckenzie on Feb 16, 2015 6:30:26 GMT
Jack doesn’t believe that they need the conch any longer because he thinks that there are certain people who should have a say and that everyone else shouldn't have a say. He has always resented the conch. Jack wishes to have control and the ability to state his opinions whenever he wants without anyone disagreeing, but the conch is his obstacle to power. By undermining the conch, he is showing the other boys that the conch doesn't have much authority, seeing as though he can speak without it. I think Jack's decisions are needing to be more thought out as he is showing that breaking the rules is ok. I am sure if he was in the position of the chief, he would crumble as he lacks the strictness that an authoritarian is supposed to have. |
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Post by zoewatson on Feb 16, 2015 7:33:59 GMT
Jack doesn’t believe that they need the conch any longer because he thinks that there are certain people who should have a say and that everyone else shouldn't have a say. He has always resented the conch. Jack wishes to have control and the ability to state his opinions whenever he wants without anyone disagreeing, but the conch is his obstacle to power. By undermining the conch, he is showing the other boys that the conch doesn't have much authority, seeing as though he can speak without it. Towards the start of the book Jack was all for the conch. It gave him the power of being able to speak without interruption but now as the conch is not helping his authority, he thinks it's a ridiculous thing to have and says they don't need it. |
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Post by isabelleewert on Feb 16, 2015 19:43:45 GMT
"We know who ought to say things here!" How is Jack undermining the authority of the conch? When Jack says this during a meeting, he is undermining the power of the conch as well as the authority of Ralph. Jack really wants to be in control of the boys and by speaking out of turn suggests that he believes he is worthy of being chief and that he has no need for the conch. Jack implys that the rule of the conch doesn't apply to him and that if he has something to say, he should be able to say it whenever he likes. Ralph is undermined as the conch is really the only thing as chief which he has control over and if Jack is not obeying the rule, then he is a step closer to becoming the leader. |
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Post by lindadate on Feb 17, 2015 7:33:19 GMT
"We know who ought to say things here!" How is Jack undermining the authority of the conch? When Jack says this during a meeting, he is undermining the power of the conch as well as the authority of Ralph. Jack really wants to be in control of the boys and by speaking out of turn suggests that he believes he is worthy of being chief and that he has no need for the conch. Jack implys that the rule of the conch doesn't apply to him and that if he has something to say, he should be able to say it whenever he likes. Ralph is undermined as the conch is really the only thing as chief which he has control over and if Jack is not obeying the rule, then he is a step closer to becoming the leader. Jack also does not want boys such as Simon making their opinions heard, as he thinks that they have nothing beneficial to say. |
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Post by zoel on Feb 17, 2015 7:52:46 GMT
Jack is taking away the power of the conch by not following the rules of the conch. The conch is a symbol of civilisation and order and jack is trying to, not only, take away the power from the conch, but from everyone whom he deems "unworthy"
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Post by emilyhadzalic on Feb 17, 2015 10:17:37 GMT
Jack is undermining the authority of the conch by not holding it while he is speaking and not letting others who are holding it have their turn to speak. Jack saying "we know who ought to say things" suggests that he thinks he should be the one who has the biggest say, and boys such as Simon, Bill and Walters opinions and ideas did not matter. I agree that Jack is undermining the authority of the conch because he thinks that Simon, Bill and Walter's opinions don't matter and that he wants the biggest say. He probably wants more than just the biggest say though, because by denying other people the right to speak he's trying to get all of the say. He's determined to undermine the authority of the conch because it's just another thing that's stopping him from having all of the power, and having power over other things is the most important thing to him while democracy and fairness mean nothing to him unless they'll help him get what he wants. |
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Post by Hope15 on Feb 18, 2015 5:02:40 GMT
Jack is undermining the authority of the conch by not holding it while he is speaking and not letting others who are holding it have their turn to speak. Jack saying "we know who ought to say things" suggests that he thinks he should be the one who has the biggest say, and boys such as Simon, Bill and Walters opinions and ideas did not matter. I like how you pointed out that Jack thinks that some of the other opinions do not matter. I think Jack want to have more authority than the rest of the group and thinks himself above these rules such as only the person with the conch may speak. |
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Post by kayleewilliams on Feb 18, 2015 8:06:10 GMT
"We know who ought to say things here!" How is Jack undermining the authority of the conch? Jack is undermining the authority of the conch because he is disobeying the rules, believing his words are more important than anyone else's. |
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Post by zoebia on Feb 18, 2015 9:46:22 GMT
"We know who ought to say things here!" How is Jack undermining the authority of the conch? Jack is undermining the authority by not abiding by the rules that were first stated when they all became one group. Jack thinks that his opinion matters more than everyone elses, therefore doesn't need to have the conch to speak. This represents the falling of the community. I agree with the fact that jacks behaviour is resulting in the community failing, and I think it will also start to influence some of the other boys and that's the reason why the authority of the conch is undermined. The boys may start to think they can speak freely and not follow rules set out for them to stay civilised |
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Post by mackenzieg on Feb 18, 2015 11:18:33 GMT
"We know who ought to say things here!" How is Jack undermining the authority of the conch? By saying this, jack shows that he thinks he is superior to the other boys in the way that he is allowed to talk whenever he wants instead of having to pass around the conch. Jack disobeying the rule that was put forth at the begging of the novel shows the falling of civilisation and order in the group of boys and shows that jack is pushing himself away from the group in a way. |
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Post by stewarts on Feb 19, 2015 2:22:18 GMT
Jack is undermining the authority of the conch as he is not holding it and therefor does not have the right to speak, but he is doing so anyway, defying the boys rules and customs and corrupting their society.
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